National Transportation Safety Board

“ THE WITNESS: Most of our simulator instructors are line experienced, retired pilots on a contract basis with Korean Air. As far as line instructors, as in the case of Captain Lee that just testified this morning, that's based on flight experience and overall experience that they would be selected. As far as the exact figure, I don't have that.
MR. FEITH: Is there any special training curriculum for a instructor pilot once he has been selected?
THE WITNESS: Yes, there is. Ground school is 13 hours, eight hours on simulator instruction and on how to -- how to use the simulator equipment. ”

“ THE WITNESS: Guam Emergency Plan is the focal agency that addresses those issues, and when the -- those agencies fall under the Civil Defense plan. So if there's an exercise and you -- you -- you make it realistic, then -- then Civil Defense has to step in and coordinate the resources for these exercise.
MR. FEITH: Have you ever had another airplane accident other than commercial transport? Any kind of airplane accident off the airport?
THE WITNESS: No, sir.
MR. FEITH: So you're -- you've never been involved with an aircraft accident of any sort? ”

“ Have you ever seen in training operations or in line flying operations when a pilot is flying a non-precision approach step-down method where the pilot will set the mode control panel altitude down to the next step-down altitude too soon? ”

“ The only remark I would like to make is that when it comes to the environment of cockpit operation that they -- that it needs to become culture-free in order to obtain our objective of safety standard. So, not so much cultural adaptation but driving the crews toward a culture-free state more in order to -- this culture-free cockpit environment to reach the objectives of safety rather than cultural adaptation or cultural aspect to approach the safety objective from this -- this angle. ”

“ According to Korean Air procedures, what circumstances would -- require a go-around on a non-precision approach?
THE WITNESS: First, assuming the aircraft does at the MDA and at the missed approach point there is no visual to the runway, he would perform go-around. Secondly, below 500 feet in the case of an instrument failure he would perform a go-around. Thirdly, at any time the pilot feels that it is in the interest of safety he can perform a go-around at any time. That's all. ”

“ THE WITNESS: There is no problem when the pipe was removed or bent inward. There wasn't any problem for a vehicle to move in and out to one point to another point.
MR. HAMMACK: Would you classify that road as a one-lane road, two-lane road?
THE WITNESS: I would classify it as a one-lane road. Heavy equipment that goes in there, that's the only equipment that can go in there. There is no other vehicle that can go on either side because of the embankment of both sides.
MR. HAMMACK: Mr. Chairman, that's all the questions I have.
CHAIRMAN FRANCIS: Korean Air? ”

“ Are there any non-precision approach scenarios used in training where the DME used for the approach is not located on the airport?
THE WITNESS: Up to now, no. We teach the basic principles of a non-precision approach, that they would be able to appropriately -- when they review the approach plate they would be able to react accordingly according to the needs of the approach.
CAPTAIN MISENCIK: Could you describe some of the scenarios used in simulator training which help pilots adapt to unexpected situations during approach procedures?
FIRST OFFICER CHUNG: Unexpected scenarios you said? ”

“ THE WITNESS: As a manager I always emphasize step-down procedures and I really don't want to answer this question, but I'll give you the best one I can. And in reference to the Guam Airport, of course.
First, you start at 2600 feet at Guam. Once the altitude is captured and it's put in the altitude hold mode, you would set 2000 on the window, which is the next altitude. I would require or request the first -- excuse me, the pilot not flying to continue to call out the DME for me. Once I crossed the DME in-bound for the 2000-foot restriction then I would descend down to 1440 feet. ”

“ Are you qualified to instruct both on the airplane and on the simulator?
THE WITNESS: Let me start. Generally speaking or as a matter of principle, instructor pilot is qualified to teach both simulator and the actualaircraft. However -- however, in the case of Boeing 747 Classic simulation instruction is sourced out to contractors. They -- they are dedicated instructors hired from outside. And in-house instructor pilots handle aircraft instruction. ”

“ THE WITNESS: We have that particular individual go through counseling with a chief pilot. If that should not prove to be a solution we try to usethe un-matching policy among the -- those two or whoever -- among the people involved. Once a person is on an unmatched policy with another individual, the two of them would not fly together until one of them got out of that aircraft type.
CAPTAIN MISENCIK: Has the Korean Air ever been warned or been in danger of losing Part 129 authorization to operate into the United States or any of its territories? ”

“ THE WITNESS: Listening to the contents of the CVR extracted from the accident, we can see that on numerous occasions first officer and the flight engineer kept asking the question whether glide scope -- glide slope was working or not. You just told us during your testimony that it is absolutely against your training instructions to try to execute landing when there is any problem with the glide slope. ”

“ THE WITNESS: The situation there at that time was very chaotic simply because there was a lot of people hanging around wanting to go into the -- to the accident site. And so, it was necessary to take control and not only necessary to take control but you -- we set up the command post because my responsibility is to coordinate all the Government of Guam resources in -- in delivering the needed supplies, manpower to the accident site to -- you know, like the volunteers, the triage team. Everybody wanted to get down there, so we just simply had to control it. ”

“ THE WITNESS: It is true that most of our line captains have educational experiences that stem from United States. Most of -- most of our aircraft have been purchased from the United States so that actual training would take place in the U.S. as well in a lot of the circumstances. So most of the captain are familiar with U.S. customs and the training philosophies. ”

“ THE WITNESS: During this crash we had capabilities to suppress that fire. However, being that type of area, the remoteness of it with the type of vegetations, the -- where it was actually located, it was just impossible, sir, to do any fire suppressionat that moment. We cannot fully activate our suppression unit and our rescue unit until we have order for the bulldozer to come down and make a road down to the crash site. Then again that took about three hours till we get a -- an opening to roll down some kind of apparatus down there or medic unit. ”

“ THE WITNESS: I attended a four-year university and majored in Political Science. In '75 I entered the Air Force as a lieutenant. And in 1960 I went through the U.S. Air Force navigator training qualification program. I also have training in instruction as an instructor.
Then I separated from the Air Force in '69 and entered the Korean Airlines at that time. Until 1977 I was in the position of a navigator -- flight navigator for Korean Airlines. After that time I transitioned to a flight engineer and I have served in the 727 aircraft, A300, and the 747. ”

“ How many times does the KCAB observe training sessions, the simulator training sessions profiles one through 10 or whatever the profile is up to the check ride?
THE WITNESS: They don't have appreciable number of training sessions that they observe. However, for the check ride simulator -- simulator check rides they do observe it from start to finish.
CAPTAIN MISENCIK: Okay. And in the simulator check rides what percentage are observed by the KCAB?
THE WITNESS: As I said before, for smaller aircraft types for simulator check ride, the KCAB participates directly. ”

“ THE WITNESS: Since the accident KCAB has said that the destination airport is not varied enough and the types of approaches are not varied enough.
CAPTAIN MISENCIK: Are there training scenarios where a pilot is expecting a -- a full ILS but there is a diversion to a -- an airport with a non-precision approach that is not a standard Korean Air destination? ”

“ Captain Lee, in non-precision approaches, is it Korean Air policy to use step-downs or a constant descent for the approach?
THE WITNESS: Basically, we are teaching them to use a step-down method. But when the weather condition is BMC and also pilot -- when pilot select the medial -- medium altimeters -- altitude and also in the condition that he or she will maintain the above the altitude he might choose the constant lower-down for the passengers' sakes. But what we emphasize is he must maintain the -- the chart-depicted altitude. ”

“ Are you getting good cooperation from all the other departments, the Navy and Air Force and all them?
THE WITNESS: Yes, sir.
MR. HAMMACK: Any problems -- any resistance from them?
THE WITNESS: No. No problem. Whenever we ask for their assistance they're there. Unless they're -- for some reason they can't respond to help.
MR. HAMMACK: I mean in -- in planning for the next problem are you getting any resistance in the area of cooperation in the -- in the mutual aid agreement area?
THE WITNESS: Not on the Fire Department's standpoint. And that again will be worked on with the Guam Emergency Plan. ”

“ THE WITNESS: It is entirely up to the judgment of the instructor pilot whether either hand-fly -- hand-flying or autopilot mode is to be used. However, in the initial period of flight for the sake of flight control -- better control, manual flying mode is more frequently practiced. That is for the initial phase of the training process. ”

“ THE WITNESS: That's a difficult problem and I would like to talk to you about it through an example. All air crew members participating in a CRM education program -- at the time of entering into the program about 80 percent of all crew members feel that they are qualified or fall in a category -- I'm sorry? That they're best qualified air crew. They grade themselves to be in the upper category. But at the end of the program those who when they reassess their cockpit operations styles and such, this number fallsto somewhere around 10 percent. ”

“ Captain Lee, what is Korean Air policy regarding a pilot following a navigational indication that has been reported inoperative or unusable? How should a pilot regard a glide slope indication that may appear normal to him but has been reported unusable or inoperative? ”

“ When it comes to the younger people in our airline, we -- the media -- the media --
FIRST OFFICER CHUNG: I would say their thoughts are more progressive due to the influence by the media I believe is what he's saying.
(Resumption of translation)
THE WITNESS: So that have we not come a long ways from the old way of thinking.
MR. FEITH: If I can just get a summary of yes or no, given all of that explanation is there a reluctance on the line pilot part to accept all of the training philosophies and this -- this new way of doing business in the cockpit?
THE WITNESS: Yes. I feel as I see it, yes. ”

“ THE WITNESS: All crews are supposed to monitor the altimeter while the altitude is changing. If for some reason such as mechanical failure or just anomalies that the airplane fails to capture an altitude, it is expected that the first crew to notice this with call it out.
MR. BERMAN: Okay. I understand.
Referring to the approach chart for the ILS approach to runway 6-left executing the approach with the glide slope inoperative, what would the crew do if the outer marker were not received in this approach? ”

“ I would just say, I guess, that there's an enormous amount of very work --good work being done on culture in the cockpit and cross cultures in the cockpit, and -- and I hope that all of us that are involved in this industry and -- and in aviation safety will be paying a lot of attention to this, and as you commented earlier, that we'll be constantly adapting to -- to what we learn as we go on. ”

“ For the later stage of the training process auto -- the autopilot mode is more frequently instructed.
When manual flight is being executed, it starts from under altitude 10,000 feet. When the weather condition is IMC, then the autopilot's mode is suggested -- recommended. The use of autopilot indicates a non-precision. It's limited to MDA only. That's all.
CAPTAIN MISENCIK: Do Korean Air procedures require that the correct navigation frequency is tuned and identified?
THE WITNESS: Yes, it is a requirement, and that's the responsibilities of all the crews -- all the crew involved. ”

“ The crew did not talk about it from what was on the CVR, and there, from my point of view in reading the CVR, did not appear to be any reaction to those call-outs. Is there a procedure or a policy at Korean Air that would require the crew to either identify those call-outs and/or react to those call-outs?
THE WITNESS: First, why the CVR has those --why the CVR recorded what we hear I don't -- I can't imagine why this happened. Yeah, we teach this during instrument flight rules education. All simulator training and procedures teach immediate responses to minimum GPWS call-outs. ”

“ Do you have knowledge of how many approaches in normal line operations at Korean Air are non-precision approaches?
THE WITNESS: At the home base of -- of Seoul Kimpo Airport we always use -- I correct that statement. We often use non-precision approaches. At domestic airports of -- in particular Chachu (ph) Airport we also use the non-precision approaches. The 747 Classic has many destination airports in Southeast Asia or Middle Eastern countries. In these areas it's quite often we see non-precision approaches. ”