“ I am actually a lot less fussed about the need to shift pages because that is a problem that can be reduced through technological means; I just haven't found the time to hack up the scripts yet. For DjVus it is even feasible to make an interactive tool to let arbitrary contributors perform simple surgery on the file. The lack of decent MW support for gadgets (including a decent story for a UI widget library) makes it a lot more fiddly to do than it needs to be, but it is absolutely doable. ”

“ I don’t think it will be too much of a problem. As you can see, the images are displayed on the reel side-by-side, which makes it easiest for me to scan in two pages per image. The “Book” template form I placed on all of the individual scanned images; the only thing I need is the microfilm information, which I can get the next time I see the reel. The work itself looks great! All that’s needed is to remove the placeholders, add the information template, and the file can be moved to Commons and the work on the index started. ”

“ No worries about any wasted time. If something isn't clear it's always better to ask (some people will actually rather fume in silence over such things, and I have no idea why) . If one of my edits doesn't make sense you should feel free to assume I was insufficiently caffeinated until we can establish otherwise.
Regarding the #tag:pages syntax, the only instance I'm aware of where it's needed is when you have discontiguous pages that must be joined without a line break (a newspaper article that's "continued on p. 42" and similar) . ”

“ The key difference here is that redlinked pages attract new contributors, and yellow pages attract a few dedicated Validators (too few, but that's a more tractable problem) , but "bluelinked" "Not proofread" pages actively turn away contributors. Those pages are never going to get proofread (barring a few minor exceptions) . Even the Match&Split pages have this problem, and while they may contain slightly "better" text than raw OCR, they still are not actually proofread against the scan (except in the roughest most mechanical sense) , much less being consistently formatted. ”

“ The optimal format would be a one-page-per-image, followed by a single two-page spread per image, followed by exactly four pages per image. Odd numbers of pages per image will almost invariably lead to a need for manual interventions, and inconsistent number of pages per image within a single batch / work will similarly need manual work. ”

“ It's the continuing and accelerating accumulation of crap that gets me down. We need to set standards and stick to them, instead of this monomaniacal hoarder approach.
Gutenberg has first-mover advantage, and mindshare (wiki = Wikipedia; we're invisible next to big sister) ; and it operates in a conceptual framework that normal people can relate to. Even the "Product Manager" nonsense is something people understand, and most people will most of the time appreciate being led (less thinking, less responsibility, and genuinely less effort: see Monthly Challenge) . ”

“ I also know several contributors that flat out refuse to work on such pages; and I sympathise because I feel much the same, except I have a pretty low threshold for just nuking whatever is there and replacing it with ad hoc OCR text from the gadget (my ocrtoy also does a few banal fixups) . Which is, incidentally, a neat little trick when validating: the diff will then show you the usual noise, but also sometimes trouble spots, like punctuation that got mixed up in the proofreading, that are hard to spot otherwise. ”

“ That said, I do, in general, support a purge of abandoned crapbooks in mainspace, though my personal preference is to find a scan first and make sure it's in place before deleting so the blue link to a crap page is replaced by a redlink and a blue {{ssl}} on the author page pointing to a nice, tidy, inviting index page. We do indeed really need to clean up some of the mainspace crap, and also try to transition some almost-crap to "decent" status. ”

“ You're trying to find a completely general solution to this problem, but the problem isn't actually one uniform one: it's a cluster of similar ones. A completely general solution is going to be hard and might actually impossible. Instead, I suggest looking for more narrow subsets that are easier to solve; because very often these kinds of problems are the result of a single human being with a particular habit (and there are a finite number of humans here) . For example, it's possible you could search for r'{{c| (.*?) ”

“ If there were issues with {{peh}} when used through a single tag then I'm unsure what might have caused it. I'm not aware of any code changes recently that seem likely to have caused something like this (not that I necessarily would pick up all such) , but if it was a side effect of some change elsewhere in Mediawiki (not directly related to PRP) it's certainly possible. If that's the case, any edit to the mainspace page (the transcluding page) should force any cache to get regenerated in normal circumstances. ”

“ Our major advantage is our ability to provide higher-quality transcriptions with clear provenance and metadata. The openness and lack of a gatekeeper are good things but mixed blessings: they also turn people off ("Everyone will see what I do!", "Really, they let just anyone do it?!?") ”

“ I have been doing this for individual replacements for a while and should be able to (fairly easily) script it for multiple pages. So all the uploaded tif should be replaced with logoless png. So, more waiting is very good right now. Striping the logos from the page scans is not just a pretty upgrade, sometimes that logo is blocking text or covering portions of images. I am considering Index:St. Nicholas, vol. 40.1 (1912-1913) .djvu where a whole section was replaced -- to replace that with logoless scans. ”

“ Also, some kind of outreach must be needed, because how do projects like PGDP attract so many people when their interface is so dreadful and you have to deal with honest-to-God self-assigned "Project Managers" for each work? ”

“ Most of the time these kinds of changes also manage to invalidate the cache without any end-user action (there are both automatic dependency-based mechanisms and periodical scheduled jobs for this) , but some such code changes can end up needing an edit (which is why we sometimes have to run a "touch edit" bot job; these days usually invisibly because the bot can "purge" the page instead of actually editing it) . Xover (talk) 07:27, 25 February 2022 (UTC) Gah! There are instances where direct transclusion is still used, such as Tables of Contents on Index pages. ”

“ One day the pandemic will be over, sane people will be voted into political office, and my unbounded optimism will assert itself. Real soon now, I'm sure. Xover (talk) 11:31, 21 December 2021 (UTC) To be clear, I certainly do not support letting thousands of red pages pollute the mainspace, I just don't really have the emotional energy to cultivate strong feelings about red pages that are quarantined (ugh so bored of that word) in Page namespace. ”

“ Inductiveload—talk/contribs 11:57, 21 December 2021 (UTC) @Inductiveload: The way it goes is this: someone finds a page containing some random fragments of a work as barely-formatted-above-OCR, and proposes it for deletion. Two people vote to delete it, one of whom provides a scan and a basic index as an alternative. A third person then shows up and Match&Splits the crap into that index. ”

“ The bathrobe brigade then votes to keep it because it is now scan-backed. Net result? We have a fragmentary work, with the same crap barely-above-OCR text (ok, I exaggerate for effect; sometimes the quality is more or less decent) , sitting in mainspace. The Index: has random red "Not proofread" pages, which, as I keep repeating turns people off from working on that Index. Ever. The net result? The crap copydump is now a complicated crap copydump that actively discourages improvement. I appreciate the philosophical differences and that reasonable men may disagree on the individual case. I do. ”

“ Ebola and Marburg Hemorrhagic Fevers Neglected Tropical Diseases When this was imported the importer dutifully imported all the references which had a link in the page, however, what it did not import was all the references that were given by a range in the text itself, as I've encountered missing references which are in the PLOS original, but not in the version/edition as presented on Wikisource. ”

“ I have the tools to automate a vast number of image manipulation operations, but if I can't apply them identically to every image we'll soon end up where it would actually be faster to do it by hand in Photoshop or similar. But for images that are sufficiently uniform etc., processing anything up to something like a thousand pages shouldn't be a problem.
Anyways... Have a look at the result and see if it looks ok. Xover (talk) 11:03, 7 April 2022 (UTC) First, thanks! Second, there are no pp. 24–25 (a printer’s error) , so no placeholders are needed. ”

“ A change that has upsides, also has downsides, for the very same population you were trying to serve well! Thank you for persisting anyway. :-) Shenme (talk) 21:46, 14 January 2022 (UTC) Ugh, I hadn't considered that this would happen. Indeed δ ̓ and λ ̓ should not combine the diacritic with the characters, and this is how Greek does words where the end of the word drops because of interaction with the following word. Think of it as like "I d' know" (for I don't know) . Putting the apostrophe above the d is not correct. This sort of thing is fairly common in the Greek texts I transcribe. ”

“ That's one of the reasons why direct transclusion shouldn't be used.
Similarly, if pages are transcluded using separate instances of PRP's <pages ... /> extension tag the automatic hyphen handling will not work since Mediawiki invokes the extension with only the content provided in that instance of the tag. Or put another way, each individual use of lives in its own little world and knows nothing about other content on the wikipage, including any other tags that may be present. ”

“ And our lack of a professional-ish standard for conduct and tolerance for all sorts, means we get all sorts and newcomers get exposed to all sorts, which turns away a large chunk of the population (enWP wonders why they have a gender gap, in long confrontational discussions where nobody uses any cuss words but all except the borderline psychopaths go to bed crying) . ”

“ Yeah, if we could at least keep mainspace clean—except for the inevitable edge-cases—I'd feel a lot better. In the mean time, I should probably take up meditation or something. Or, hey, pay a professional to listen to my ranting. Xover (talk) 15:24, 21 December 2021 (UTC) it almost never happens: this is certainly true, but that (rather interesting) research question must be relative: is it more or less true than it is for the literal millions of pages that don't exist at all? ”

“ PS. If bots start hitting on you, you know they're getting close to taking over the world. I for one welcome our robot overlords! :) Xover (talk) 18:20, 16 May 2022 (UTC) Potential workflow for scanned microfilm documents I ask this question here, rather than on Scan Lab, because I think you might be able to set up a process—but I’m not sure, so I’ll get to the point. I have scanned in some documents on microfilm, but they need to be processed before they can be uploaded. ”

“ For the 30-image work, I put in effort to have four pages (or page-areas) per file; however, because that was quite difficult, and led in some cases to horizontal offsets, in the future I will probably only scan for two pages per image. TE (æ) A,ea. (talk) 14:29, 1 April 2022 (UTC) @TE (æ) A,ea.: I've looked into the example image a bit to see what's feasible.
Color inversion is easy and fully automated, so it's just an extra step to throw in that the computer takes care of. ”

“ I've tweaked {{sdelete}} to categorise in all namespaces. nocat = false only bypasses the blacklist (regex of page names where cats should not be added, primarily for /Archive pages) , but has no effect when it's in a namespace {{category handler}} doesn't know about (and it doesn't know about Page: and Index:) . Xover (talk) 08:50, 27 February 2022 (UTC) @CalendulaAsteraceae: Ok, I think I've got all of them now. Please let me know if I messed up anything else there. Xover (talk) 10:18, 27 February 2022 (UTC) Thank you! Everything looks good to me. ”