“ I agree that we should not have one template for works published more than 95 years ago and no-renewal and no-notice situations. I'm not a fan of a flat PD-US, but a mere naming of a template (the main template) isn't going to stop licenses from being carelessly placed on works. I don't understand what you mean by the publication date, though. ”

“ The Masterpieces of Greek Literature (1902) is a collection of many works, but they happen to have been bound together and published in a single volume. The World's Famous Orations is likewise a collection of works, but with a narrower focus and over several volumes, some of which are parts of a sub-collection: Volume I is Greece, but Volumes 8 to 10 constitute a single collection for America. You have provided no criteria for deciding which of these items warrant a Mainspace page and which do not. All you have said is that we shouldn't look at the volumes. ”

“ Any template that is set to operate based on a fixed range after the author's death or the work's publication date will produce this issue of perpetual monitoring. Such an approach might be possible on Commons, with a larger community to constantly adjust, but for a smaller community like Wikisource, it is not the best approach. It is better to have templates that adjust their display based on information provided about the date of publication or date of the author's death. ”

“ It is a complete retelling. So, the translation bears more in common with its source text than a retelling. Under our current Versions page structure, both novels would be listed on the same Versions page because they derive one from the other. But an English translation from a German copy would be placed on a separate page, simply because it is a translation. Translations in library catalogs and on Wikidata are treated simply as editions of the source text, with only a data code indicating that the language has changed. Retellings and derivative works are treated completely separately. ”

“ The Toolserver is a relatively complex beast, so reducing it to simple statements are going to misleading. Nobody but the maintainer can normally restart a tool, unless there is a security or infrastructure stability issue that requires intervention by "sysadmin"-type people. ”

“ Romeo and Juliet story was not in English, then "Romeo and Juliet" would need to become a Translations page, and this would be true of many of Shakespeare's plays, as his plays were not the first tellings of the stories. A Work: namespace would absorb all the Translations pages and lists of editions of the same work, and thus draw a clear divide between listings of the same work (Work:) and related works that are derived from each other, which would then be the focus of Versions pages. Right now. we draw a divide between works originally in English and works not originally in English. ”

“ The OCR tool on Toolserver fetches the scanned page image and passes it and the language code to Google's Vision API (all Google sees is the scan image, the language code, and the IP of the Toolserver; your browser never communicates with Google directly) . The Google API then returns the extracted text, which the tool on Toolserver returns to your web browser, and which the gadget code then inserts into the text field for editing. ”

“ Right now, there is a broad scope in the problem, as you have noted, on the one hand between items that are the same work, and on the other items that clearly are not the same work. These disparate items may or may not appear on a Versions page at the whim of an editor. A Work: item would always be for a specific work, making a clear distinction between the two types of listings. The Work: namespace would also include translations. ”

“ A translation can be placed side-by-side with the original, aligning the texts. We have a translation namespace that does just that for multiple texts, from books of the Bible to poetry by Catullus. In contrast, a retelling by Charles Lamb will bear little resemblance to the parent text, even though it might be written in the same language. In a library catalog, translations of a work are still considered to be copies of the same work ”

“ The proposal would shift that division to editions of the same work versus versions of similar works. The concern about wildly different editions is already a problem. There are two entirely different early editions of Shakespeare's King Lear, and some modern prints of Shakespeare's works include both for completeness. Despite the differences, they are clearly supposed to be the same work by the same author, whereas a retelling by Charles Lamb for Tales from Shakspeare is clearly not an edition of the same work, but is a related story. ”

“ Also, if we use the same naming as Commons, people may assume our licensing works just like Commons, and it doesn't. I'm not saying that we shouldn't change licensing template, but I am saying we shouldn't be looking at the confusion on Commons to decided what we should do here. ”

“ In regards to Wikidata, I'll take a look at the procedures for that. I'm not very familiar with it yet, most of my contributions being solely at enWP. In regards to the portal, creating one that is a redirect to the subsection of the US case law portal seems like the best idea at the moment, since the half-dozen works added thus far seems a little too small and specific to justify having its own portal, but there are many thousands more that exist and just aren't added as of yet. In regards to the link to source, I left it in the original commit message; I'll add it to the talk page. ”

“ The WP article w:Romeo and Juliet there is more than the words of the work itself. WikiCommons' c:Romeo and Juliet is definitely not focused on the base publication, they are the concept. Our versions page focuses on the conceptual, editions, and derived works, and we are arguing about derived works, and the interwikis definitely cater for that aspect, so I don't see a huge difference. ”

“ Wikidata does allow items to link to redirect, as far as I know, but I do think that it is preferable to have it link to a versions page with only one single version (option #2) than any of the other suggested alternatives. —Beleg Tâl (talk) 15:28, 17 December 2019 (UTC) As far as I can tell, this happened because we had items at those locations, then Wikidata items were created for them en masse using a bot, then someone here cleaned up the local item by redirecting the page to a scan-backed copy. The result is that WD now has a data item for the redirect. ”

“ Category:Texts without page numbers‎ It is not clear which texts should come here: texts whose original publications are numbered but these numbers are not mirrored at Wikisource (which is true for most texts here which are not backed by scans) or texts whose original publications are not numbered? If there is a reason for existence of this category and after its aim is cleared, it can be at least partially populated by a bot. ”

“ What do you think about pages such as The New York Times, which are in the Main namespace? Typically we have hosted the main page for periodicals in the Main namespace, with links to the individual volumes. --EncycloPetey (talk) 02:51, 10 December 2019 (UTC)
to question. That NYT page "as is" is portal namespace page, though has mongrel mix of both components. The root NYT page is an entry point to the transcribed/transcluded content. Newspapers are tricky as we are never going to have all their content EVER. So we just can set them up to link to our content in the main ns. ”

“ Shakespeare's works are extreme examples that help find those points in a way that Christie's paltry two versions do not. But the problem is general. --Xover (talk) 20:46, 30 December 2019 (UTC) And the vast majority of works that have a version page will have two versions on there. Most books were never reprinted. Few were ever made into plays or came out in significantly different editions. A page for one of Shakespeare's plays can afford to be the exception. Moreover, "would have" is begging trouble from the future. ”

“ For us a work is an edition, a static publication. If it is dynamic work it should be consider as either numerous static editions, or it is not part of our scope WS:WWI.
Some examples of "problematic" things that we get into
Hong Kong Fact Sheets This is a series of individual publications that are updated at various times; or it is a couple of sets of updated publications; or it is dynamic work Traffic Signs Manual This is either several publications or versions. It is not what it purports, and is not main namespace. ”

“ And just to rub salt in the wound, the Google OCR tool/gadget was, AIUI, developed by the WMF Community Tech team; meaning that not only is no actually sensitive data being transmitted, but every component involved that might conceivably be an attack vector is actually under the WMF's direct control. ”

“ The main thing I am afraid of is that once we get a "reasonably functional" tool, we will never get a well functional one. --Jan Kameníček (talk) 23:40, 19 December 2019 (UTC)
Yes, my experience is similar. But it depends on the text -- for some texts, it does a pretty nice job. IMO it's more important to have something for new users than nothing, when it comes to OCR. For the reasons you describe, I'm sure that Wikisource users would continue to advocate for something more functional regardless of whether or not the Google one is enabled, so I do not share your concern in this instance. ”

“ There will be a new schema for XML dumps. Scripts and apps that use them will need to be updated. If they are not updated they will no longer work. The {{REVISIONID}} magic word will no longer work in the content namespaces. This is for performance reasons. When you preview a page it returns "" (empty string) . When you read a page it returns "-" (dash) . In the future this will also affect other namespaces. The next ones are file and category namespaces. Tech news prepared by Tech News writers and posted by bot • Contribute • Translate • Get help • Give feedback • Subscribe or unsubscribe. ”

“ Works that contain bits of text in other languages, which never come out right. (d) Works that contain special diacritical marks. (e) Works that contain unusual archaic typography, such as special characters for "ct", or italicized script that the OCR can't handle. If you're working on a text that consists primarily of standard sentences and paragraphs, without italics or any special characters, and without archaic spellings or archaic typography, that is entirely in English, then Google's OCR might be useful. ”

“ In order to resolve these discussions it would be valuable with wider input from the community.
Copyright discussions require some understanding of copyright and our copyright policy, but often the sticking points are not intricate questions of law so one need not be an intellectual property lawyer to provide valuable input (most actual copyright questions are clear cut, so it's usually not these that linger) . For other discussions it is simply the low number of participants that makes determining a consensus challenging, and so any further input on the matter would be helpful. ”

“ For Toolserver tools in general, the way to get the tool restarted is to contact the maintainer. They're the only ones with the access rights to do so. --Xover (talk) 07:29, 18 December 2019 (UTC) For the record, it looks like Tpt is also a maintainer of Phetools, which is good news since Tpt is still quite active on Wikisource. If either Phe or Tpt want to add me as a maintainer as well, I would be happy to help keep an eye on it. I'm a secondary maintainer on lots of random Tool Forge tools. ”

“ The focus of our page is not on the derived works, each of our presentations has/should ahve its own item, and that has been our practice — billinghurst sDrewth 02:32, 31 December 2019 (UTC) The Wikipedia article is about the play. If the Wikipedia article were listed here it would be placed on a disambiguation page. So comparing what the Wikipedia article does to what we do is fallacious reasoning. Commons content will vary depending on the number of items in a category. When a category grows large enough, subcategories are split off. ”

“ I can see the argument that a series of novels should be broken out by title, but I think it gets real messy in the case of anthologies and periodicals, especially when we're talking about excerpts of longer works and intros that cover multiple works.--Prosfilaes (talk) 11:36, 23 December 2019 (UTC) No, of course not. New Hampshire is a single published work. These sets are not single published works. They are multiple individually published works that the publisher has declared to be volumes in a set. ”

“ Disambiguation pages can be structured to capture some of the aspects of derivative works. Translations versions are for works of the original author, where there are different translations/editions of translations main namespace pages, can link to WD item for enWP article Portal: ns pages exist for curation where required. ”

“ A few items: (1) I see no link to the original source of the text copy. A link to the source of the text copy should appear in the header, or on the item's Talk page. (2) You've overlinked. there is no reason to link to Wikipedia articles like "Magazine", "Advertising", or "New York". (3) The judge who authored the decision should be identified in the header or header notes. Also, you can center an image without using the template ”

“ Tech News
Because of the holidays the next issue of Tech News will be sent out on 6 January 2020. Recent changes
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“ It will be on all wikis from 5 December (calendar) . Meetings
You can join the technical advice meeting on IRC. During the meeting, volunteer developers can ask for advice. The meeting will be on 4 December at 16:00 (UTC) . See how to join. ”